[mellow R&B music] - All right, welcome back, everybody, to Fatherhood, the series where we celebrate black dads and the many ways they show up for their families.

In today's episode, we're talking with fathers who are raising children with special needs and disabilities.

From the moment of diagnosis, to the everyday highs and lows, they open up about what the journey really looks like, the challenges, the growth, and the love that keeps them going.

This is an honest, heartfelt look at parenting through a different lens.

To help me unpack this experience, I'm sitting down with some amazing fathers who are walking this road and showing us what real advocacy looks like.

Today with us, we have the owner of Shabazz Fitness, Mr. Raheem Shabazz, the owner of Just Pest Control, Mr. Jason Warren.

- Thank you.

- Recording artist and pastor, Courtney Franklin.

And we have stay at home dad, Mr. Raymond Wade.

Gentlemen, how y'all doing?

- Awesome.

- Doing well.

- Doing great.

- Great, great.

Well, thank you so much for being with us today.

Well, look, we got a lot to discuss.

A lot to discuss, so let's just go ahead and dive right into the conversation, shall we?

- Yes, sir.

- Sure.

- Yes, sir.

- All right.

So the first topic that we want to talk about is your journey as fathers, right?

So I would love to hear from you guys, how did you first learn about your child's diagnosis, and what are some of the emotions that you went through in that moment?

- Well, the first time I experienced that is when my son was about two.

He was slow to walk, and we had got diagnosed that he may have autism.

And they got him into physical therapy.

And we had some doctors to tell us to, I mean, some really bad things about this.

Like, "You got a place for him to stay?

"You may not be able to take care of him.

He may not be able to, you know, take a bath, help himself."

And I looked at them, I said, "Man, you don't know who I know.

I know God, doc."

- Mm-hmm.

- I said, "That's gonna be a great man."

I said, "So just let me do what I do, and we'll talk about it later."

And years later, here we are.

He's got some limitations, but nothing like they said he would have.

- Love it.

- Yes, sir.

- Love it.

What about you?

- Our story's similar, kind of.

So my wife had our son two months earlier, premature.

- Okay.

- And immediately, we knew something was wrong.

He was non-responsive, black, blue, purple, just horrible.

And we got the diagnosis after our 60-day stint in the NICU.

So when we were leaving, they said, "Oh, by the way, he has cerebral palsy, "and one of you is never gonna go back to work, because he's also very seizure prone."

- Wow.

- So that's how we found out.

And it's been a tumultuous ride [laughs] since then.

- What was your initial reaction when they told you?

I mean, you said that you were walking out, and they just kind of dropped that on you on the way out.

- Well, I was heartbroken before that, because for seven days, there was no response beyond brain and heart.

So every organ was not working.

His fluids was building up in his body.

And I didn't tell my wife, I did not let her know what was going on for the first four days.

I took all the blows, all the bad news, all the blah, blah, blah.

And it was hard.

I remember day three, going home, I had my brother just drive me home.

And I went to take a bath for the first time in three days.

And I cried for the first 30 minutes in the bathtub.

I just finally snapped.

- Yeah.

- 'Cause I was trying to be He-Man for my wife.

- Yeah.

- And it was just horrible, man.

It was horrible.

[participant coughing] Emotionally, it was not- - Yeah.

- I was not good.

- Yeah.

- God bless you, man.

- Exactly.

- What about you, Shabazz?

- I would say my situation may not be as typical, because when my wife and I got together, she had two kids.

I had my one son, and both of her kids were special needs.

One was older.

She had a brain condition, where she had multiple sicknesses and it wound up leaving her with certain permanent brain damage.

And the youngest son at the time, Steve was nine.

And Steve has autism.

And I went into my marriage knowing that I had two kids that was, you know, that had special needs.

And it really didn't bother me much, because I knew going in what the situation was, and I knew also, I'm gonna just shower them with all kind of love.

- Yeah.

- And knowing that going in, knowing that it would be, there would be challenges along the way.

They had already overcome so much before my wife and I even got together.

And my mindset was, you know, with God, with faith, our guidance, they're gonna continue to overcome.

You know, all we had to do was guide them the right way, knowing that it wouldn't be typical.

- Exactly.

- But it would be a challenge, but we were up for the challenge.

And because it was easy for us, as far as we knew that we would just shower them with love, because that's just the type of people that we were.

You know what I mean?

So it was a challenge, but our faith was strong, and we just walked right into it, you know?

So yeah.

We're doing all right.

- Good.

Good, good.

Raymond?

- Okay, well, I didn't find out 'til my daughter probably was in first grade, kindergarten, first grade.

- Okay.

- We kept getting these reports when she was in school that she had problems with, you know, how people say, give me 50 feet, you know?

She had violated everybody's personal space, would be rubbing in their hair, and all this other stuff.

So we kept hearing that, and we took her to the doctor.

And the doctor, I think on two or three occasions, called her a "Chatty Cathy".

So, you know, we was like, well, you know, that's it.

There's something not right, because we noticed it at home too, how, you know, up in our space she is, and you know, things of that nature, how much she likes to talk.

And at the same time, you don't want to take the spirit of the child out of the child.

- Right.

- Mm-hmm.

- You know?

But you have to pay attention to, you know, I always say, if more than one person says something about a certain subject, I'm gonna pretty much take it to the bank, you know, that it's gonna be true.

So we found her a good therapist, and, you know, psychiatrist, and, you know, we explained to them that, you know, she needs help.

And if she needs medicine, then by all means, you know, let her have it.

But we also don't want her, you know, I grew up in the time of Ritalin, you know, where the kids would just sit in the classroom and be zombies.

- Yeah.

- Mm-hmm.

- You know, so we didn't want that for her.

You know, 'cause she's a great kid.

She's 17 now, and, you know, her GPA is a high 3.

She just got accepted to the Honor Society.

She wants to go to the University of Memphis.

You know, so she's a great kid, but it takes a lot of, what's the word I'm looking for?

You know, like everybody else say, you know, just love and, you know, understanding.

- Mm-hmm.

- Yeah.

- You know, 'cause a lot of parents, you know, see bad behavior in their children, and instead of looking deeper into the situation they would rather cuss at 'em and beat on them, you know?

- Yeah, yeah.

- Mm-hmm.

- And you can't beat your kid into submission all the time.

- Exactly.

- Right, right.

- And you know, you're right.

It does take a lot of love, and I think patience as well.

- Yes.

- Because my wife and I, our oldest daughter has ADHD as well.

- Yes, sir.

- And we kind of found out in a similar way to you, Raymond.

You know, people, you know, multiple sources telling us things about our daughter that were very similar.

- Yeah.

- And it was behavior that we noticed as well.

- Mm-hmm.

- But, you know, especially with girls, you know, you have to be soft.

You have to be patient.

And so, it has been at, at first, it was a pretty trying time, but, you know, it's still the same little girl that we've always known, right?

- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

- Right.

- We just have to be cognizant of what she's going through and what she's dealing with, and be able to meet her there in a soft and patient way.

- Exactly.

- So, thank you all for sharing that.

- But can I- - And, yeah, go ahead.

Go ahead, please.

- Like, you said, I think that's one thing we need to bring up too, the wives, how much we buffer a lot of things from them- - Mm-hmm.

- To kind of absorb the blow, is what I'm calling it.

- Yeah.

- Mm-hmm.

- And my wife and I, my wife had a real hard time of, "Was it me?

Did I do something wrong?"

- Mine too.

- You know what I'm talking about?

"I ate this, I ate that.

I fed him something wrong."

- Yeah, yeah.

- "No, I remember you pureeing everything," you know?

- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

- So let's just back up- - Mm-hmm.

- Assess the situation, absorb the blow, and let's just move on.

Because wives take it really hard, that it was something I did.

- Yeah.

- And I'm like, no, it's not.

- And then, I've seen on the flip side, I would just encourage every parent to not be in denial.

- Yes.

- No question.

- Because there's a side that makes them feel guilty, and there's condemnation.

But then there's another flip side of that, where people see all of these signs, and hear everybody saying, something's not right.

And because it's their baby- - Yeah, yeah.

- Then they- - Ignore it.

- Live in denial, and denial is delay for treatment.

- It is.

- So you need to make sure, it's better to be safe than sorry, get it checked out, get it tested so that something can be done- - Right.

- Before it's way out of whack.

And now embarrassment causes you not to have the child a social life at all.

- Exactly.

- Yeah.

- Yeah.

- And that's a good point, Courtney.

And I think that's a good segue into the next portion of the conversation.

- Sure.

- You know, the day-to-day realities, right?

So what are some of the unique challenges that y'all face as fathers, you know, that have kids living with disabilities or special needs?

What does that look like for you?

- The key word that has been brought up twice is patience.

- Yep.

- And because sometimes, you know, we're hit with surprises quite a bit.

- Yeah.

- Mm-hmm.

- And it takes a great deal of patience to say, "Okay, I'm not gonna react too fast to this.

Let me diagnose this a little bit."

- Absolutely.

- "Let's see what's going on.

"Let me take a whole lot of time to let me breathe.

Let's get through this."

- Mm-hmm.

- You know what I mean?

I have the luxury of having my facility at my home.

So all of my athletes that I train, all of my clients that I train, you know, they come to my house.

We have a 2,000 square foot facility, we have space outside.

Now, Steve is 26 now.

Steve works, you know, he knows his schedule inside and out, and something that, when Steve is off, he still has his routine, his schedule.

- Oh yeah.

- But every now and then, while I'm in there working, Steve pops in.

And so, I can't get mad at my man for, "Man, you see me work."

Never, you know?

I stop everything.

Everybody knows Steve, everybody shout Steve out.

I call Steve the GOAT.

[participants laughing] Everybody knows he's the GOAT, the GOAT is here.

[all laughing] "What's up, Steve?"

You know what I mean?

And whatever issue it is, whatever situation, whatever conversation you need to have right then, we have it.

That happens quite a bit.

And I count it as a blessing, because if a special needs child lets you in, you're in.

And early on in my wife and our marriage, Steve was 9, now he's 26.

And I'm the only dad he's ever known since he was that age.

- Mm-hmm.

- So any surprises that comes up, he's comfortable enough coming to dad, "Dad, what is this?

"Dad, what's up with this?

"Dad, what can I do about this?

Dad, what I need to do about this?"

And I don't care what it is, Steve doesn't have a filter.

So he's gonna ask.

[all laughing] And I don't mind, because that's my man.

- Yeah.

- And like I said, a great deal of patience, a great deal of, you know, you gotta be thoughtful.

You have to be considerate.

You gotta be compassionate.

I mean, you have to, because- - Yeah.

- You're dipping into a world that most people just won't take-- - Won't understand.

- The time to understand.

- Yeah.

- And so, when you make the attempt to understand, and I know all these brothers can agree that it takes so much effort.

- Yeah.

- Sure.

- That's another word.

A lot of effort, a lot of patience.

But everyday things like that, you know, we're hit with surprises every now and then, and I didn't mention that we have a grand, Callie.

- Okay.

- Callie is five.

Callie is non-verbal autistic also.

But the great thing about us having Steve, is that we recognized the symptoms with Callie very early.

And we knew the situation.

We nurtured it.

She lives with us.

Steve lives with us, Brittany lives with us, and we take every day, day to day.

You know what I mean?

And like I said, I keep going back to this word, patience, a lot of it.

But it's a blessing that once they let you in, you're in, and they trust you enough to know where their source comes from, where their, you know, comfort comes from.

So yeah.

Those are the type of things that we deal with every day.

- So yeah, patience and effort, those are two things, right?

But there is a such thing as pouring from an empty cup.

Right?

So where do you find the strength and the balance to keep it all together?

- Patience.

Let's get back to that.

I didn't have that at first.

[Nate chuckling] I was dead head on.

And what I mean by head on, okay?

"We gonna get this.

"Playboy, you gonna just have to play the role.

You gonna have to come on."

My wife, every once in a while, just tell her, "Hey, I think you might need to take a walk "'cause it's some father and son time, finna be some furniture moving up in here."

You know what I'm talking about?

- Mm-hmm.

- Especially when I know you know, and you just playing on it.

Let's go on and handle this business.

My neighbor used to laugh.

They used to hear me in the backyard.

"Hey man, your lines ain't straight."

Cutting grass.

Everybody, "He don't need to be cutting grass."

Stop pampering this boy.

He's growing to be a man.

- Mm-hmm.

- I told you from the jump, he's a special dude.

[participants chuckling] He got to learn manhood.

Men work.

That's what I'm teaching.

But at the same time, you got to give that love too, to let him know, I'm just not being hard on you.

I'm just showing you what you have to do.

Now, look at him.

It's a blessing.

People come to our house now, he wanna be the first one to greet 'em.

"Hey, Uncle June, Hey, Uncle Red."

You know?

It's a beautiful thing to see that.

- We had to teach our daughter that, you know, it may seem, you know, it may seem a little crazy.

You know, but you have to go through life.

As my parents raised me, all they told me was, I have three strikes against me.

One of 'em is I'm an African American, I'm a male, and I can't see.

Other than that, you know what I'm saying?

The sky's the limit.

But I have to work super hard.

- Yeah.

- Super hard.

You know, and it's gonna be some times when you get down about it.

Sometimes, I get down by being visually impaired.

It sucks, you know, really bad.

When you got other people, you know, riding around the street in they cars and- - Yeah.

- I'm walking, and I'm crossing the street and there's other, you know, these people, they're not really paying attention to me and my little river white cane over here.

So I've been ran over like three times.

- Whoa!

- Wow!

- You know?

But, you know, we have to tell her that it's no stigmatism.

That's what I think a lot of people see a disability as, as a stigmatism.

- Yeah.

- And it's only a stigmatism if you let it be.

- Yeah.

- You know?

You can't let anything hold you down, because that's what they expect.

- Yeah.

- Mm-hmm.

- That's what they want you to do.

Especially African-Americans, you know, let's just, you know, be real about it.

They expect African-Americans to really not produce a whole lot and to live under these labels that they put on your children, on our children.

You know, they have ADHD, so they're not very intelligent.

Oh, he's visually impaired, so you can't do this, this, that, and the third.

- Yeah.

- You know?

So it has to be, you have to not look at it as a stigmatism or something that you've done wrong, you know, to deserve, you know, the child that you have.

- Yes, sir.

- Mm-hmm.

- You know what I'm saying?

God, however you look at it- - Picked us.

- Absolutely, picked us.

- Mm-hmm.

- He picked us.

- You know?

- Because I tell people all the time, this is a special treat.

And what I mean by that is, everybody ain't blessed to have one.

- Brother, I cannot not agree more.

- I'm telling you, everybody ain't blessed to have one.

- That's right.

- So when you get one, He gave 'em to you for a reason.

He gave 'em to you, 'cause He knew you could handle it.

- Yep.

- And He put something in all of us.

- Sure.

- Yeah.

- As men, because we have seen, I have seen so many women alone, and their husband, or a boyfriend, or whoever walked away.

- Yeah, abandoned them, because the, they child is special needs.

- Exactly.

- They don't wanna deal with it, that's right.

- So if this forum that we're in right now could touch one dude to say, "Man, let me go back."

- It's worth it.

- Man, it's worth every bit of it.

Because you just don't know what blessing you're missing, missing out on.

[participant chuckling] Moms can do some things, but dad can push him a whole lot further.

- Yeah.

- And my wife and I see that.

- Please let me speak on that.

- Yes, sir.

- When my wife and I got together, it was interesting that, and I go back to an example with Steve.

I remember like it was yesterday.

Steve jumping up and down on the couch, watching TV, watching cartoons.

Brittany in the other room, looking like, "Hey, man, this is just Steve do."

My wife in the bedroom, just like, "Babe, this is just what he do."

I walked in that room, I said, "Hey, boy," - There you go.

- "Sit down."

- Thank you.

- And we've been good ever since.

[all laughing] And Steve looked at me, he said... - Exactly.

- And sat his behind down.

I believe wholeheartedly, the biggest blessing that God gave to us was to allow us to be fathers.

- Yes.

- Yep.

- And I mean, and to be able to do it with a special needs child.

- Yeah, hold on, I'm gonna tell you how smart this one is.

He's sitting right over there.

In the third grade, I would always pop up at the school.

- Mm-hmm.

- Because my job was flexible.

I have not missed one appointment with my kids.

- Yeah.

- I got two, a daughter and a son.

Daughter is finna be a junior at MTSU, and Josh.

I would show up, he would be cutting a rug.

I would step, the teachers would allow me just to step in the room.

I didn't have to say anything.

He up doing his thing, and he see me.

The first thing he'd do, [participant faintly speaking] hold on.

[participant laughing] [participant clapping] And the teachers was like- - Straightened right up.

- What just happened?

[participant chuckling] - Mm-hmm.

- I said, "Don't say what he can't do."

- Right.

- Because he know- - Yeah.

- Who to play on.

- Yeah.

- Yeah.

- I said, "Once he find out he can't play on you, he'll do that."

- Yeah.

- I mean, the teacher was blown away.

[Jason chuckling] - And I appreciate y'all sharing that.

And that's, you know, fantastic, fantastic dialogue.

I'm really loving it.

Courtney, I got a question for you.

I would love to talk about, you know, the system for a moment.

What are some changes that you'd like to see in society that, to make it a better environment for children with special needs, or "special love" as you and your wife like to refer to it.

- That's our term.

- I think that's beautiful.

- We don't use special needs.

We use special love.

I think that, you ask me, so I'm gonna be very transparent- - Please.

- In my answer.

I think that if we live in the wealthiest country in the world, then more money should be allocated for children and parents who, of nothing that they've done- - Mm-hmm.

- Born into these situations.

- Yeah.

- I remember when my son crossed the threshold from being able to ride in my truck or my wife's car, to us needing a van, and to having no extra money to buy a van.

And everywhere we applied for some grant or some rich couple who was donating money to this and that through a grant, we were denied.

And I'm saying, but I have to get my baby to the doctor.

- Yeah.

- I have to, and it breaks my heart to see him in the backseat of my truck with his legs pinned, because it's not enough space.

And eventually, my dad stepped in and bought him a van.

But everybody doesn't have that luxury, right?

- Right.

- I wish that there could be some allocation for help.

Sometimes, my wife and I need to breathe.

- Yeah.

- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

- My son is nonverbal and immobile.

- Mm.

- Mm-hmm.

- So if there's not a nurse there, our lives are put on hold.

- Yeah.

- And then, I'm an artist.

I travel all over the world singing.

Sometimes, my wife is there alone for multiple days at a time.

She needs a break.

- Yeah, yeah.

- Mm-hmm.

- But there's money for everything under the sun, except rivers of it for special love children.

I think that's something that we should revisit.

- And it's hard.

- Thank you, yeah.

- And I'll add to that, it's hard to find out how do you get in different programs, even something like physical therapy.

Unless you know somebody that has autism with a child that can point you in the right direction, you never know.

- You never know, right.

- I didn't know I needed a conservatorship for my son when he turned 18.

You know how I found out?

By a friend of mine, their daughter had down syndrome.

He said, "Hey, man, you make sure you get that conservatorship."

I said... - Right.

- He said, "Yeah.

He ain't gonna be able to make decisions for himself for health."

- Yeah.

- I said, "Okay."

He said, "Just something you need to know."

- Mm-hmm.

- So along those same lines, what is some advice that you and all of you would give to a new parent, a new father who just found out that their child has a disability or is in need of special love?

[participants sighing] - Man, keep pounding that pavement, you know?

And stay on your kids' teachers, you know, when they go to school, and make sure that they're doing the proper thing.

You know, make sure your child has the IEP.

- Yeah.

- You know, for extended time for taking tests, and homework, and whatnot.

Because I do understand that, you know, school is a lot of pressure.

- Mm-hmm.

- You know, and when you have a learning disability, or physical disability, you know, it can be overwhelming.

You know, I have to get this done.

And some kids don't have any concept of deadlines, you know, and so, you can't pressure a kid like that.

- Yeah.

- Well, for a new father that's experienced this, the first thing I would tell them is sit in it for a minute.

Sit in it for a minute, learn to absorb the blow, is what I call it.

And then, move from there.

- And it also goes back to, don't deny it.

- Yes.

- Mm-hmm.

- Yeah.

- Yes.

Once you get to that point, I think you'll be a whole, it's gonna be overwhelming, but just take it one day at a time.

- One day at a time.

Well, look, gentlemen, this has been an amazing, amazing conversation.

And as we've learned today and heard today, being a father doesn't come with a blueprint, especially when you're raising a child with special needs or a need of special love.

But what these men have shown us is that with advocacy, love, and resilience, there's no limit to what our children and our fathers can overcome.

Thank you to our panelists for opening up and sharing their powerful stories.

And a special thanks to you at home for watching and being a part of this important conversation.

[mellow R&B music] [acoustic guitar chords]